Cribs

[Packer Backer]

Is there a map or GPS coordinates showing crib locations on the Flambeau or is that something the DNR would rather not show?

[djs]

I was just up there last week. That subject came up with my bro in law who works for the DNR. That subject is a touchy one...
There is such a thing as the information act, and it should be made public to anyone who wants to know where they are. The fact of the matter is... the people who spend all the hard time making them and putting them out on the ice know where they are, and lots of other people do to. They know the exact gps coords for most of the newer ones. The DNR wont freely release them to the public... for reasons unknown, but they should!
Look at the latest map of the flowage for the most detailed look... and from I understand there in the makings of a newer map that is even more detailed. Hopefully that will be public in a few years.

Hope this help you out!!

[MinnowCatcher]

a good one: 115.17714"W 36.12340"N

[Don Pemble]

Got a little news for you, I've helped the DNR on previous occasions building CRIBS and have never been invited to help them out placing them on the flowage, I never had a clue as to where they put them, it's their own little secret where they put them, I've had to spend my time and my own resources looking for them, and it's very rewarding when you find one and maybe get lucky and find a few more, and without the help of coords, do I have the ones I've found marked on a GPS, (NO), I don't use one out there, when I or my clients want to fish the cribs, it's an exploration of sorts, we look for them, and when we find one, it's like finding a little piece of heaven, that is until you don't get a bite on one and have to search for another, guess you call that fishing and not catching. I just happen to be one of those guys, or guides who will throw out a marker on a crib and look for another crib before fishing the first one, kind of keeps you from fishing the same one twice. I believe the reason the DNR is not giving out GPS coords on the cribs is to keep our panfish population alive and well. Let's all go back a few years, 25 panfish bag limit per day per angler, that was before the bluegills made a big comeback, several angler's were taking their 25 crappie a day and going back out and catching another limit, and every day they were doing this. Guess where all the crappie went????? This one species alone still has not made a total comeback, and even with the 10 panfish rule and 10 inch size limit on crappies, there may never be the number of crappies we once had. So, you think the DNR should reveal the coords on these cribs, I think not, they, along with several hard working people who have put their time in working on these cribs to create a more friendy fishery for all to enjoy not to just zoom in on and reap the bounty. YES, I will fish cribs, and only from my memory as to where they are, not from GPS coords or some newly marked map, and only if my clients request it or if we are having a totally unproductive day and it's the only way to produce a fish fry for them. Wake up and go fishing, learn the water on your own, if you find a crib or a special submerged stump that hold fish, mark your spots with land marks, keep them to youself, for if you don't, you will have boat loads of fishing terrorists surrounding your boat trying to take what you have discovered. The DNR should not have to release the coords like you say, spend the time and find your own, I have and so does everyone else.

MY OPINION

[Packer Backer]

oooooooook

[beelzebob]

If you haven't guessed, this can be a very contentious issue on this body of water. There are some groups that feel since they help with the cribs and or own property on the lake that they "own" the cribs as well..... you'll never get them to say it outright but that feeling is there. I have been in the midst of pleasant conversations with lakefront owners and other fishermen who suddenly turned quite sour at the mention of fishing the cribs, particularly if it involved a guide. There is no defensible reason for this line of thinking, but like many things, it is what it is. If you choose, you can e-mail me and I will tell you the depth and general features to look for..... the cribs tend to be quite specifically located and once you know what to look for, you'll find them. Lastly, don't be suprised if you pull up and get skunked - they don't produce all of the time and you can't be sloppy.

[djs]

Don... I have fished with you, and we had a tough time in the early morning. I know your feelings on the cribs. I was relating as to what my Bother in law stated. I have been fishing there for over 25 years now, and STILL don't use cribs. You put us on a crib... simply to show us a few new techniqes to use for deeper water panfish.
I do know that there is gonna be a newer map... like I said... with some of the cribs of late ON the maps... with GPS coords. A new lake survey is in the makings especially for the fact of locating the river channels better and showing the locations of underwater stump fields a little more accurately.
IMO.... this is impossible cause I don't care how long you have fished out there... a new stump finds your lower unit sooner or later. I go out when the water is really low and take pics. I make my own assumptions as to where fish are.
When we were up there over the last week of July... The fish were in 2-3 feet of water.... no need for cribs there!
I also simply enjoy just boating around looking at the natural beauty... no matter how many times you have been there... always something new to see!
A Moose up at the entrance to 4 mile creek... yupp. A wolf down at rat lake... yupp. Heard it late at night looking for a big eye on the shrelines. I honestly don't care about the location of cribs, and feel you need to find 'em yourselves... but... I was simply stating the law, and if someone asks... they are required by law to release the info. SO..... if enough peeps complain... all will know where they are and the fish will be even harder to boat.

I am for finding them myself, AND the law. Stinks to say that... but its just the simple facts.

[ski2313]

I was simply stating the law, and if someone asks... they are required by law to release the info.

Which law would that be?

[djs]

The freedom of information act.... The Flowage is governed by the state of Wisconsin. Any and all activities are there for the public to see... or are supposed to be when asked for.

Thats it... plain and simple. If I am wrong... please correct me!

[ski2313]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_Information_Act_(United_States)

It says here the act only applies to federal agencies..

WDNR is a state agency. Call them and demand gps coordinates for cribs though. I bet it would be an interesting conversation, followed promptly by "click".

I have roughly 30 crib coordinates: some given to me in confidence by friends, many of them found by myself.. but Don's advice is sound, and I'm even more impressed with him after hearing that he doesn't use a GPS to locate the cribs. That's incredible. In my opinion the cribs are only good for cold fronts and mayfly hatches to deliver on a promised shore-lunch. The rest of the structure iin the Flambeau is way more interesting (and fun) than a 6x6 chunk of logs.

Here's a good starting point... Mud lake.. Townline.. and the west side of long island..

tight lines.

[Nick Kanauz]

FIA's cost you a lot of money to be sure. The governing body can charge for any and all expenses involved in producing the paperwork you request. I just retired from a large Western Michigan newspaper, and our editor related to me that the cheapest cost he was ever billed for one was over 1K.
I enjoy the TFF with my brothers each year, and it has always been a beautiful place. I am glad they chose to share it with me. We experiment with new spots every year, and have actually found some interesting locations for Walleyes. Thanks for all your help on The Flowage Don...it has been great fishing with you. Good luck to all, and safe boating while you are out there!

[Flambeau Vista Retreat LLC]

The cribs are built and placed by the Turtle-Flambeau Flowage-Trude Lake Property Owners Association with guidance from the WDNR. Thank them for this benefit to the Flowage, or better yet, send them a contribution to build more cribs and fish habitat. Even better, get your butts out there during the freezing temps and help build and place cribs this next Winter/Spring. Though I have not personally done it, I understand that there is some great chili and beverages afterwards. ERGO: They are not subject to the Federal Freedom of Information Act. If you have any questions about it, please contact me;however, I think "Tom 502" is best to contact. Tom, please give these dedicated Flowage followers the info. Thank-you to all that care about the Turtle-Flambeau Flowage, Wisconsin's Largest Wilderness Water ( no passport required). Also, please support the Turtle-Flambeau Flowage Association by attending the annual pork/corn roast and kareoke celebration this Saturday at the Midway Bar and Fine Dining 10 miles West/North from Butternut on Highway F/FF starting at 3:00 P.M. Scott www.flambeauvista.com

[BlueRanger]

If anyone else had the common sense to simply call or email the DNR before spouting off, they would have learned that nobody is withholding anything, because they don't bother to GPS each crib when they tow them out and sink them. But they do mark the general areas on their master map of the Flowage, and you're more than welcome to visit the office in Mercer and copy that information onto your own map.

[gdi]

I asked once after I saw a photo of about 15 cribs out by Pink rock. I was told to start looking in 10 to 15 foot of water and guess what not hard to find and the hunt was the best part. While riding around looking for those you be surprised at all the thing you see and find. Keep up the good work you guys and like they said just ask I did and I was helped.

gdi

[LundAngler]

It's really not that much unlike deer hunting. There have been entire days I've spent "fishing" on the flowage, which end up to be more like me zigzaging all over the place, staring at the sonar unit, looking for good structure and fish. Sometimes I wonder what other boats may be thinking of my "drunken" boating. Just like hunting, the more time you put in, the better the odds of finding your very own hot spot.

[djs]

"geological and geophysical information and data, including maps, are not included."

This is a part of the FOIA.

I read deeper into it, and we DO have the right to know what our planet looks like, as long as there is not a government agency or military base in the area that information is requested.

[ski2313]

In certain areas of the flowage, there are cribs on bottom.. they look like 6x6x6 bunches of logs strapped together with branches tucked in between. The older ones are full of algae. Any other specific questions on the appearance of our planet?

[Musky Mauler]

With regard to whomever might think that the FOIA only applies to the FEDERAL government, they are correct. However, Wisconsin also has a similar law - - Wisconsin Statute 19.31 states:

In recognition of the fact that a representative government is dependent upon an informed electorate, it is declared to be the public policy of this state that all persons are entitled to the greatest possible information regarding the affairs of government and the official acts of those officers and employees who represent them. Further, providing persons with such information is declared to be an essential function of a representative government and an integral part of the routine duties of officers and employees whose responsibility it is to provide such information. To that end, ss. 19.32 to 19.37 shall be construed in every instance with a presumption of complete public access, consistent with the conduct of governmental business. The denial of public access generally is contrary to the public interest, and only in an exceptional case may access be denied.