New to forum and TTF

[BobS]

Sorry for posting in Don's update thread but the site wouldn’t allow me to post last night.

Hello all I'm looking for some quick tips on Bastine and Trude. I have fished the Chippewa Flowage for more years than I care to admit and have branched out in search for new waters. What color is the water, green, stained or clear? Where is the water level, up or down?

I prefer action over trophy hunts and Pike are really my favorite species. I enjoy casting spinnerbaits over weedbeds and through stumps so the TTF is my kind of meat. So if there is anything you can throw my way it will be appreciated. I'll file a report once back home. Thanks!

[mikesgotone]

The water is stained. If its pike you seek you can find em on the tff. although for some reason they have stunted growth. still fun though. spinners work. we always tip em with a twister tail. its a must. you got the right idea. weeds and stumps. the combo of both works best. good luck! have fun.

[ToddM]

Actually, the pike on trude and the turlte flambeau do not have stunted growth, in fact their growth rates are above average. The reason for their small average size is that their average life span is only 4 years. There are alot of 16-22" pike in the flowage, some nice smallies in the 13-19"+ range and alot of walleyes. It also has a small musky population and you can catch them small to really big in there. Very dark water, not alot of submerged weeds but emergent reeds can be found in quite a few areas. There can be some cabbage areas associated with the reeds in small areas, those are good spots. Lots and lots and lots of huge stumps, in places you would not expect them. These are the big mature tree stump variety. Good fish spots too but be careful, they are hard to see.

[George]

Okay...why are the pike living only 4 years?

[Tom502]

Bob S.

Click here for a great background on the fishery of the TFF.

http://basineducation.uwex.edu/upperchip/waterways/lakes-streams-rivers.htm

Tight Lines,

Tom502

[George]

Tom...this also dealt with the northern question. It tells the what, but the why still looks like a bit of a mystery. Interesting.

Northern pike may be the second most abundant game fish in the Flowage. Our 1997 survey produced a population estimate of 2 adult pike per acre – possibly enough to adversely affect natural recruitment of young muskellunge via predation. Only 3% of the 2,925 pike captured in 1997 were longer than 23.0 inches. Poor size structure may be attributable to slower-than-average growth rate and high natural mortality by age six. The reason for this is not well understood. Fish that live longer than six years exhibit average growth rate, and they can achieve desirable sizes. The largest pike captured in 1997 was 36 inches long.

[ToddM]

I read a study in minnesota awhile back about short living pike. They lived shallow, the water got really warm. They would not eat bluegill type forage but that is not the case with the TFF but they do live shallow where the water can typically get to 80 degrees by the end of june. Another thing I have noticed about the pike are the black dots on them. Has to be soe sort of parasite. I wonder if that has anything to do with it. Of all the pike we have caught, they were fun for my kids, we have only caught one decent one above 23" and it was around 34" long.

Too bad the musky natural reproduction was not good, I bet this lake could have some nice hybrids in it.

[George]

WOW 34"...for the flowage that's a monster! I don't know the scientific name (Blue help me out here) but it's called Black Spot. It's a parasite that is hosted by snails who are eaten by smaller fish who are a prey species for larger game fish. Each acts as a host. According to reports you can eat them, since cooking kills the parasite. I'm not sure if humans could be a host not. But, a)...not very pretty and b)...why chance it?

[LundAngler]

As taken from http://www.fish.state.pa.us/images/pages/qa/fish/worms.htm

Black spot disease is commonly observed in rock bass and other sunfish, bass, pike, perch, minnows, and other fish species. It can be identified by the presence of small black spots, usually about the size of a pin head, in the skin, the fins, the musculature, and the mouth of the fish. The black spots are caused by pigment that the fish deposits around the larval stage of a parasitic digenetic trematode, usually a Neascus spp.

The lifecycle of the "black spot" parasite is complex. The adult parasite is found in a fish eating bird, the kingfisher. The larval parasite is transferred from the infected fish to the bird during the feeding process. In the kingfisher, the larval stage develops into an adult parasite. The adult parasite in the intestine of the bird produces eggs that are eventually deposited in the water. There the eggs mature, hatch, and develop into the miracidium stage of the parasite. The miracidium infects a snail. In the snail, the miracidium develops into the cercaria life stage. The cercaria leaves the snail and actively penetrates a host fish. In the fish, the parasite becomes encysted. In about 22 days, black spots form around the cyst. This entire lifecycle takes at least 112 days to complete.

In general, the presence of the "black spot" parasite does not affect the growth or the longevity of the infected fish; however massive infections in young fish may cause fish mortality. The parasite is incapable of infecting humans and, as is the case with all fish parasites, it is destroyed by thorough cooking. When fish are heavily infected, some anglers prefer to remove the skin to improve the appearance of the cooked fish.

Hope it helps!
Jeff

[BlueRanger]

Given that the scientific name is Uvulifer ambloplitis, I can see the advantage to just calling it what it looks like.

Here's a short article describing various fish parasites:

http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/volunteer/janfeb06/raw.html

By the way, I have been doing plenty of fishing on the TFF this summer, but with the exception of the nice warm weekend a little over 2 weeks ago, the musky action hasn't been worth talking about. Hoping fall weather brings some improvement, but with this year's strange weather, I'm not counting on it. I did spend a nice evening stalking brown trout on the Rush River in western WI yesterday. And my camera recently died after capturing just over 11,000 photos in 4 years and I haven't quite decided on its replacement, so I haven't uploaded any new photos in a while. That should be rectified within the next couple weeks.

[George]

Thanks for the info guys! Glad I can always count on your back-up.

[BobS]

To close things out from my end this trip was a total bust! I can deal with 3 days of 30 MPH gusts and 2-1/2 days of non-stop rain. What I can’t control is water level that is 2 or 3 feet low. The last thing I do before stetting out for the Chippewa Flowage is to call Jenk’s bait shop and get a water level report.

High water means I can fish lost lakes, bust behind bogs and many other places that don’t exist when the level is low. I was limited to the North end of Lake Bastine because I only had a 6 horse motor and I had my Scaredy Cat dog with me. The lake bottom was all sand in my area and lush cabbage weed beds don’t get much of a foothold in sand. I would have had to pole the boat to get into Trude and portage to get into lake just South of that (the name escapes me now).

I was also surprised at how flat the terrain was, there were few hills that dropped off at the shoreline. Though I spend much less time on the water when my dog is with me. I caught ONE 24” pike in total and that was within the last hour of fishing.

The lake and area are beautiful, King’s resort was a serviceable place to stay but my days of fishing flowages who’s levels are artificially controlled are over!

[luv2brw]

More walleys for me then, thanks!!

[BobS]

More walleys for me then, thanks!!Be my guest, they are my least sought species...

[mikesgotone]

Rough one. When the winds blowin out there a 6 horse would be rough. Never had much luck on bastine. Never fish it. there's so many other areas with tons of structure. Rocks, timber, dropoffs, weeds. Whatever you like. But my family has been goin up there since my dad was a kid. I guess it takes time to get to know the flowage....Or a guide. Better luck next time.

[George]

BobS,

You mentioned checking with a bait shop before heading to the Chip. Here's a link you can check on the TFF's level.

http://dnr.wi.gov/org/land/facilities/turtleflambeau/water.html

Also, the minimum discharge at the dam is 300CFM. This year, due to the drought, it never got to that point. In fact the highest it got was around 250CFM in late May and early June.

Here's what they wrote....
Drought Condition Forecast
The Turtle-Flambeau Flowage did not completely fill this spring due to lack of snowmelt, spring rainfall and reduced river inflow into the flowage. The peak elevation reached was 1571.05 ft., which is 0.95 ft. below the normal full elevation of 1572.0 ft. Winter discharge flows were approximately 245 cfs, well below the minimum flow requirement.

Based on the current reservoir level, inflow rates, and the anticipated needs for water downstream, CFIC intends to draw down the reservoir to elevation 1568.0 ft. (4 ft. drawdown) this summer. The extended period of below normal precipitation that has been experienced over the past several years will likely continue to negatively impact inflows to the reservoir through the remainder of 2009.

Current projections are to maintain reservoir elevations above 1570.0 ft. through the end of June, if inflows to the reservoir do not decrease from current levels (150 cfs). If electrical generation needs increase in June due to hot weather, unanticipated power plant outages, or if the current drought situation intensifies, additional water could be removed from the reservoir during June to increase generation at hydro plants downstream. Discharge from the dam may also be increased to serve downstream industrial needs.


Sorry you had a bad time on the TFF, but as you said, it is a flowage. And because it is a flowage, its level is adjusted based on a whole set of predetermined conditions. Hopefully the DNR website on the water levels will be of help to you should you decide to give the TFF another try.

Oh, and one more thing...a 24" Northern on the TFF is a pretty good fish.

[Tom502]

One minor correction to the post by George from 9:37 this morning (9/03).

In about the 3rd paragraph George mentioned that the minimum discharge from the T.F.F dam was 300 CFM, but to conserve water it had been operating at less that 250 CFM all summer.

The error is that the minimum discharge is actually measured in "Cubic Feet per Second" (CFS) not "Cubic Feet per Minute" (CFM).

George nailed it from the standpoint that TFF elevation could be a lot worse than what it currently is. The operator of the TFF dam, Xcel Energy, along with WI-DNR have been very proactive in managing water levels this year. In fact, discharge has not been over 250 cfs since September of 2008.

Yes, the water level is down about 3.5 feet right now, but when in drought conditions like we have had all over the northwoods, there is not much more that can be done.

Tight Lines,

Tom502

[DonH]

Hi Bob S

I agree in that it's too bad your experience was not the greatest on the TFF. I'm sure you were aware of the size of this body of water. To go there with a 6 hp motor just limits what you can do and where you can go.

Unfortunately, you didn't have to be limited to fishing the north end of Lake Bastine. I'm sure you noticed many boats going every which way outside of Bastine. I would bet many of these guys caught fish as the TFF is loaded with walleyes and smallmouth bass. The difference is these boats could handle the conditions. It's too bad you weren't able to get to places like the Beaver Flats or Lake Baraboo for instance. I can pretty much guarantee that you would have encountered fish, and possibly lots of them.

I've been to the Chip. One time. Won't go back. Caught fish, but just wasn't impressed with the lake in general. Too many musky fisherman buzzing all over the place all day long, and being discourteous while they were buzzing around. I have never flipped anyone off while driving, but when a musky fisherman at the Chip went between myself and another guy at full bore as we were drifting over a rock bar less than 50' apart, and almost overturned us both, while him I flipped off.

[Brad K.]

Man...after reading the threads about this area...I know I'll stay away. Here's one to add...the end of July, a group of surgeons, doctors totaling 13 people went to the TFF. They hired a guide for 2 days. On a day they were out...they gut hooked a Largemouth. They didn't want to eat it but, saw the blood coming out, they measured the fish on a brand new ruler (Craftsman) & it said 15.5 inches. So they kept the fish seeing it would die anyhow. When they got to there campsite...the DNR was waiting. When they (Mr.Warden)saw the bass....got out the ruler they had & it measured 14.6. The doctor held the fish while recording everything on video. The DNR did not care that the surgeons rule said 15+...there's said 14.6. So the DNR said..."this is a 250 buck fine"...they (the surgeon)stated "come on look at the ruler"....the DNR said " you either pay the fine or, if you fight it & loose it will cost you $2200"! The surgeon & a lawyer with them said..."thats extorsion"...the warden said..."thats how it works".Between bad reports, thefts, rogue wardens....needless to say...I'll fish Sturgeon Bay where there are REAL trophys & wardens who are not *-****'s

[George G]

Hi Brad, if the ruler read 14.5 when they brought it in, that's it, video could have been of a different fish. 14.5 is 14.5. Best next time to take on larger than the 15.5, shrinkage does occur except when you describe the one that got away, those always grow as the story gets older. Thanks for sharing your story, makes me think twice about taking one at the size limit. Have a nice day.

[BobS]

Please don’t get me wrong I’m not trying to bad mouth the TFF. I had a wonderfully relaxing week with my pooch in the most beautiful area in the world (as far as I’m concerned)! I stand in back of the boat and cast an 1/8 ounce Stanley spinnerbait till I’m pooped then I might jig for a while. That’s “my way” and it usually produces multiple species but needs to be done over weeds, the deeper and more lush the better.

I’ve caught enough fish in my day to last me, it’s just when it started looking like I could be skunked for the week I started to worry. Shallow sandy shorelines are just not part of my method and when the water level is low that spells doom. I’m not saying I won’t go back to the TTF but if I do I’ll just have to change my tactics. I just want to let you all know what a great source of information you all are, thank you!

[George]

Thanks for catching the error Tom. Maybe it was just Freudian wishful thinking. 300 CFM would keep a lot more water in the flowage! ;)