Weekend Fishing

[Red Childress]

We hunted muskies this weekend and did not see/catch/smell a musky or pike. One of those weather patterns making you kinda wishing you were a sucker dragger.

[ttabaleulb]

I was wondering how the fishing was over the weekend. As much as I enjoyed that weather change, those first couple of days have always been kind of rough for me. A couple of years back, I was able to get a couple of hours fishing in before the clouds broke during a similar type front. Had all kinds of action and fish moving everywhere. As soon as the sun was out for good, the switch flipped and didn't see another fish all damn day. I am digging the weather change for sure. Water temps are still in upper 70's around here. Hoping to try a couple Fall "patterns" around here that I haven't had to chance to revisit over the last couple of years.

[Red Childress]

My plans changed in a hurry last Friday so I ended up chasing smaller fish both days over the weekend. Saturday had much better results for me than Sunday did. It was nice doing some different stuff/experimentation and fishing some different areas. It ceases to amaze me just how much the river changes over the course of a year regarding depth and bottom structure. Small changes are not evident when you fish past them all the time and just assume it is the "same as last year". The only way to really know is to drift over certain areas and take a peek with the sonar. Ditches/channels fill in, boulders/new trees roll around, weed beds and creek mouths change all the time.

I made my final tackle order for 2016 last nite in preparation for the cool water period. Hopefully, I bought the right stuff. :)

[Red Childress]

It was a tough weekend chasing Esox. 1 follow and 1 pike. Hitting Chatauqua for 12 hours tomorrow with Andy of Chautauqua Reel Outdoors. We are under a frost warning here until Tuesday morning. Ouch.

[Red Childress]

3 of us pounded the lake yesterday from Mayville to Smith Boys and could only net 1 smallish musky and 1 follow. A trolling boat netted a musky near us at about the same time. Another tough day for sure.

[ttabaleulb]

We had a lot of clear skies in my neck of the woods yesterday. I'm guessing you guys were dealing with the same conditions?

My brother and I are trying to plan a trip up that way in early November. We've never had a chance to fish up there that late in the year. Just hoping to get to fish in somewhat of a stable weather pattern if/when we do get up there.

[Red Childress]

Ultra clear skies and some decent, intermittent winds as well. Fish and bait were deeper than the previous 2 days. In hindsight, we should have changed up our program during the first half of the day.

[ttabaleulb]

Yep, those weather conditions sound like the story of my life when it comes to Musky fishing. I think our last trip had one day that was cloudy, but it was 90 and humid as all hell.

I'd love to take like 2yrs off work and fish every cloudy day possible just to make up for it. And, I'll then determine if the fishing is as good as I think it should be on overcast days. LOL

[cband]

My dad and I had a good weekend up on the lake, better for us on Sunday. I will say that with our newer lund, the windy and rainy lake days are a lot more comfortable. Still getting used to fishing with a prop boat.

[Red Childress]

Still have your jet rig too? Those fancy prop boats don't slide like the jets do!

[cband]

Yes, Have the jet rig too. Now all I need is some time to use them.

[Red Childress]

Big weather change looming. Let's hope it helps!

[ttabaleulb]

I'm in the process of planning a trip for early November, so I'm hoping we are at least in a "normal" Fall weather pattern by then. Not diggin this crap we just had at all. Lake temps around here are still around mid-upper 60's.

[Red Childress]

We fished Thursday and Friday evening and scored some decent walleye/trout. On Sunday, we had the hooks into 3 muskies and landed 2 of them. Gary lost a big fish at the boat, Steve popped a mid-30's musky on a custom Legend crankbait and I even caught one that was very thick from head to tail. Big ole head on her too. The photos do not accentuate the size/girth at all because we shot down on the fish to keep the background info out of the frame. Here are the only photos I have from Sunday thus far:

26157

26158

[ttabaleulb]

Nice work! You can tell that fish definitely has some stockiness to it. That body shape is similar to a fish I lost back in June. Basically, the transition between head, body, and tail had no contours. LOL

On my next trip out, I am hoping to do a bit of an experiment with fly size. I stopped throwing the big flies (10+ inches) a few years back. I seemed to get as much or more action on the 6-8" flies and the monster flies are just a pain to cast. I'm gonna have both rigged on this trip and do my best to get them equal time in the water and see how things go. It still seems to me that a lot of times, a fish is gonna eat when it wants to eat, no matter what happens to pass by it. I know one trip will be a tiny data set, but I am curious to see if I notice any sort of difference.

[Red Childress]

During the tougher fishing days this year (which there were plenty), I had my guys devote more time to smaller stuff and I think it helped.

The biggest mistake I see musky fishermen doing around these parts is simply fishing areas that do not consistently hold fish. I am not talking about general areas the size of football fields but the specific spots within those areas which might be the size of your living room or even smaller. The underwater structure, especially when dealing with current areas, is the most important aspect. Most everyone I see on this river gets caught up in the "bass mentality" when dealing with "fishy" looking spots and pound the shoreline rip-rap. Not all shoreline rip-rap areas hold muskies......not even close. Fishing hard does not always equate to fishing smart. I try to fish as smart as possible and that comes with years of experience on your water of choice. I learn new things about this river each year because I am trying to learn more........not launching the boat and doing the same thing all the time (unless it is working). The dilemma with many guys is that they only get X number of days to fish per year and spending time doing re-con (homework) is not in the cards. So, they fish the visible stuff because it is the most obvious and takes the shortest amount of time to figure out. Leaving the rods at home (or in the rod locker) and launching the boat just to drive/drift around and map out areas is what it takes to fully understand the water you are fishing. Guys like me who are lucky enough to have more days on the water than the average person can spend some time doing homework. It is hard to force yourself NOT to fish but it sure has been beneficial for me over the years.

The big fish I caught on Sunday was in an area that saw at least 10-20 casts land around it but after consistently changing the angle of approach, she decided to eat. She was parked in "her spot" and until a lure was placed in "her zone", she evidently was not going to move on it. It was an area that has produced big fish before and took me 18 years to stumble onto it and figure it out.

I am not speaking directly to you, Jay, as you already know this stuff.........just babbling to whomever is reading it.

[ttabaleulb]

LOL I couldn't agree more Red. Thats one of the reasons that I am revisiting the larger flies after kinda staying away from them for a couple of seasons. My "style" of fishing has changed a bit since then too.

I was definitely one of those people who seemed to always be fishing the visable structure and also mainly shallow. A few seasons ago, I decided to literally and figuratively turn my back on the shallows (6' or less), and spend some time casting into the deeper waters. It was tough early on, thats for sure. My brother would be casting shallow and he'd be seeing fish or getting some action, and I wasn't seeing anything. However, it wasn't long before the fish started showing up. It also seemed to decrease the amount of follows, but increase my hook-up opportunities. I have no problem with that.

After finding some fish deeper, I'd also try to float into the area to scan the water column for any signs of special structure or bait to try and put the puzzle together. Most times I did't really identify anything, but a few times I have, and thats a pretty cool part of this Musky challenge as far as I am concerned.

Most of my time is spent on lakes, but sometime in the future, I hope to get to spend some time fishing some rivers to try and learn something there too. As the saying goes, "so much water, so little time".

[Red Childress]

I agree. Solving small parts of the seemingly 'never-ending puzzle' is the addiction! How can a fish with the brain the size of a pea outsmart us as often as they do? Because we allow ourselves to become complacent with our current methods of hunting them. Einstein's definition of insanity applies here for sure!

[ttabaleulb]

You got that right. These fish can sure make you completely rethink your whole exsitence sometimes. And I agree about Einstein. I'd almost swear he was talking about Musky when he came up with that thought. LOL

I even find myself leaning toward throwing one particular fly pattern quite a bit. The firetiger/perch colors seem to work on every body of water I've fished so far. Its almost always my first and last patterns to throw. I've been branching out a bit and tying some olives and blues that seem to get some good action too. And I found that a red/white pattern can be awesome too. Like you mentioned about changing the angles to get some action on a spot. Theres a chance that fish would have hit anything once it was presented the way it wanted. I'm sure that I got through some spots way too fast and should work the area more. Definitely a good idea to remember on the tough days.

[Red Childress]

Red head/white body has been effective for me in clear water. Come to think of it, I should get back on that color this Fall. The first generation Kinzua trollers did very well with that color scheme too!

[ttabaleulb]

Yep, I kinda stumbled onto the red/white pattern a couple years back on glendale. Only had a couple hours to fish one morning and ended up landing 2 Musky and a 36" pike in that time. All the fish were within about 100-150 yds of each other. Needless to say, its been a go to of mine. Funny that you mention the clear water too. Now that I think about it, all the water systems that I've had the most luck with that pattern are pretty clear also.

[ppalko]

Getting to really know a specific river stretch, etc is an ongoing process for sure. Even if structural elements stay constant, there are so many other variables to consider. Once you figure out an area, the one thing to expect is that it will change at some point. Even in the lower Allegheny, subtle changes occur every year. Some years, totally ridiculous changes take place. I.e. sauger everywhere one year, no sauger the next.

Finally hit the river below Kinzua this past Saturday only to discover all the fish except one very confused largemouth were on a hunger strike. At least the ramp is nice and new!

How's the Amish brigade in the Warren dredge pool speaking of not so subtle changes that affect fishing? I think last year may have been my last trips to that area for some time. I'd rather spend the limited time I have learning new places rather than continue the frustration I got on two trips there last year.

[Red Childress]

Largemouth? That is a strange catch for sure. I have never caught one from this section of river, ever. Regarding the Amish, I was not out this weekend due to engine problems but in the weeks prior, I really had not seen them much (yet).

Spent Saturday gutting my boat and scrubbing it from top to bottom for delivery at Weigel's on Sunday morning. Sounds like I have a rod bearing going bad which means another new powerhead within 15 months of the last one! 211 hours is not even close to normal life-span of an OptiMax. I am hoping the 'warranty gods' are on my side!

I bet it was a miserable weekend on the water. We stayed under severe T-storm warnings for most of Sunday but when I drove to Franklin, it was beautiful there at 9am.

Anyone do any good over the weekend?

[muskyjerk]

last week was my 5th trip out this year and I got the low 30's fish in Red's boat. The 6th trip was Saturday on my kayak. 10:45 to 11:30AM, no lunar set or rise and water dropping, I caught 3 muskies in the 30"-35" range on the same custom Legend I used last week. I've got the musky bug again. I hope I have the time to keep feeding it.
Thanks again Red, Steve

[Red Childress]

Nice going, Steve! You better have an armed guard with that bait 24/7!

[Red Childress]

River is jacket up around here. I bet the floating leaves/weeds are a serious problem.

[Red Childress]

Possible rod bearing/powerhead problem ended up being a bad pulley so boat is fixed and ready to roll. An 8 thousand dollar repair ended up being a freebie @ Wiegel Brother's so Christmas came early for me! Now, I just need the river to calm down by Saturday. If it doesn't, we may hit Kinzua and do some stuff up there. Kinzua jumped 14 feet in the past 2 weeks and is the highest it has been since late-July....hence, the high discharge rates into the river.

[ttabaleulb]

muskyjerk,

Way to go man. Sounds like you are tuned into em right now. Hope that hot streak keeps going for ya.

Red,

Great news on the boat. Good luck this weekend. We will be heading out tomorrow. As usual, Mother Nature decided to throw a cold front our way. Looks like a 20-30 degree temp drop. Gotta love it. LOL Not sure how much time I might get throwing the "big" flies if I have to downsize a bit to get fish to eat. Guess I'll find out soon enough.

[Red Childress]

Give us an update on the hawg(s) you guys boat tomorrow. Good Luck!

[muskyjerk]

winter style trolling. Slack water on the river. Slow speed, easy on a kayak. lure with a wide tail wobble. running shallower if water is muddy/stained, 5' over 12' Saturday. Good luck.

[Red Childress]

We chased some trout/walleye around Friday evening and caught a few of each but things were kinda slow for us. Fished Chautauqua on Saturday and Sunday........we moved a few muskies (I had a nice fish strike me short and then came in real tight to boat but spooked off) and lost 2 but nothing in the net. We were doing some different things while hunting a big fish or two but things were pretty slow for us.

Hey Adam,

We saw you and your Dad trolling through Bemis on Saturday mid-morning. I waved but was in a different boat than normal.

[ttabaleulb]

Tough couple of days of fishing for us too. Cold fronts, wind, all of our favorites. LOL Got lucky and put 2 in the net. Did my best to lose and miss a few other fish. Actually pulled the fly right out of the mouth of at least 2 next to the boat.

[gfishes]

Fished the river Saturday and Sunday afternoons with limited luck. I lost a 30 inch pike at the boat. Hit a Medussa and never really got a good hook in him. My netman was in no hurry to bring the net to the front of the boat... (or maybe it was just the way I saw it :) The only other action was a 40-44" fish that followed in my Dad's shallow raider. It didn't want anything to do with the 8.

This is my first season of targeting musky. I still have a ton to learn but I am starting to see some patterns just like the bass and walleye I've chased on the river for years.


Anyone have any luck this weekend?

[Red Childress]

We fished hard the past few days and caught good numbers of bass and a few nice walleye. The trout fishing has been tougher than normal for November (at least for my boat). We hit a couple decent pike on Saturday. We lost 2 muskies on Friday with one being a stud in the upper 40" bracket. Overall, fishing was subpar for us. Water temps are running about 4 degrees above normal.

[gfishes]

We fished hard the past few days and caught good numbers of bass and a few nice walleye. The trout fishing has been tougher than normal for November (at least for my boat). We hit a couple decent pike on Saturday. We lost 2 muskies on Friday with one being a stud in the upper 40" bracket. Overall, fishing was subpar for us. Water temps are running about 4 degrees above normal.


Red, do people use the quick set rig and suckers on the river? Or is that more of a lake setup? Looking to expand my options.
thanks
Greg

[Red Childress]

Quick strike rigs are welcomed on any body of water and work in the rivers just like lakes. Most anything is better than the single-hook killing machines of yesteryear.

[gfishes]

Cool, do you know of any bait shops that sell suckers in the area?

[Red Childress]

Not in the immediate area unless things have changed the past few years. We only have 1 bait shop (as you probably know) so if they haven't started carrying them, you are out of luck. The problem is most bait shops (in this neck of the woods) think a 5-6 inch sucker is a big sucker.

[gfishes]

Not in the immediate area unless things have changed the past few years. We only have 1 bait shop (as you probably know) so if they haven't started carrying them, you are out of luck. The problem is most bait shops (in this neck of the woods) think a 5-6 inch sucker is a big sucker.


That's kind of what I figured. I live in Columbus, my families place is in the Emlenton area. I heard Odonnell's in Portersville might have them but I will look around the Columbus area too.
thank you

[25homes]

Red Do you fish Suckers on the River? Where can you get big suckers? I have creek chubs but biggest Ive got around 6-7 inches havent caught anything on the chubs at river but couple cats. Id love to get some big suckers or chubs 10 inch plus

[Red Childress]

I quit using livebait (especially for muskies) about 15 years ago. Finding/catching/transporting/babysitting big bait was just too much work. The times I did go catch it with hook and line, the largest stuff I could get was 7-8". With stuff that small, it did not really matter if I was rigged with a quick-strike rig or circle hook because they would usually inhale it before I could set the hook. Around that time, new rubber baits were hitting the market and my catches actually went up. I was covering more water hunting active fish instead of hanging around an area waiting for a grab. My clients got more enjoyment out of 'running and gunning' plus it was safer for the fish.

For me, it is not worth the risk of the fish just to put one in the net. If I had access to 12-18" suckers, I may have a little different view.

[25homes]

I quit using livebait (especially for muskies) about 15 years ago. Finding/catching/transporting/babysitting big bait was just too much work. The times I did go catch it with hook and line, the largest stuff I could get was 7-8". With stuff that small, it did not really matter if I was rigged with a quick-strike rig or circle hook because they would usually inhale it before I could set the hook. Around that time, new rubber baits were hitting the market and my catches actually went up. I was covering more water hunting active fish instead of hanging around an area waiting for a grab. My clients got more enjoyment out of 'running and gunning' plus it was safer for the fish.

For me, it is not worth the risk of the fish just to put one in the net. If I had access to 12-18" suckers, I may have a little different view.

I totally agree the quickstrike rigs ae not worth using on 6-8 inch chubs suckers and they are all so big its gawddy looking with smaller bait anyways. Im about where you are with this Red and giving up on the Live bait for now unless I find access to bigger suckers 8 inch plus atleast...Do you know any bait shops that actually carry suckers? I dont mind traveling as I can grab a few and store in my tank any advice greatly appreciated

[Red Childress]

Maybe call around the Chautauqua Lake area tackle shops......

[Red Childress]

We hunted some walleye and trout on Saturday and picked up a few eyes but no trout, again. Chased muskies on Sunday and we lost a very nice fish in the gale force winds. Both days we quit a few hours early due to rain/snow/Steelers game. Lots of fishing coming up over Thanksgiving break so hopefully we can stick a biggun or three between now and Xmas.

[25homes]

I fished all day sunday til 6pm and caught nothing was fishing a cove off the river about 100yds long about 75 yds wide..Was one other boat fishing same cove watch them land atleast 2 fish that I know of..they were definantly musky fishing too...

[Red Childress]

On Sunday, Steven (a middle school stud wrestler from the Pittsburgh area) caught his first musky on the 2nd cast of the day. He forgot his jacket that morning so he had to borrow a sweatshirt from me (in case your were wondering why his shirt looked like a dress).

We chased a mixed bag of fish during 4 of the last 5 days. Walleye fishing was good for us yesterday along with a few really nice trout sprinkled around the holiday. The bass fishing was OK but nothing like it usually is. We put 3 muskies in the net but really had to grind on them. We also hooked and lost 2 other muskies.

Here is Steven's first musky after his 2nd cast of the day:

26315

[ppalko]

That had to be a thrill getting that fish one the second cast! Perfect strategy to get a kid interested! Noticed your comment Red about the bass. Has this been a trend for you? I've pretty much stopped fishing the Warren area for bass in the fall as the fishing has reached all time lows for me in terms of smallmouth in that area. I've ranted about my theory for the decline before...just curious if this trip was normal for you this year or if you'd have other bass trips recently that were up to standard so to speak. I've been targeting walleye on the lower river and fishing has been great. Even have three musky including a 45-50 inch tank that was lost at the boat.

[25homes]

ppalko were you targeting walleye on the river? I fished lock 2 sunday for musky with no luck my brother went after walleye didnt fair to well

[ppalko]

We were after walleye. The three musky were hooked on small jigs which in years ago happened fairly often but lately has been really rare. Nice change. Walleyes averaged 14-18 inches which is typical.

[Red Childress]

Regarding the bass situation.........The Fall of 2015 and 2016 were warmer than normal which held up the bass migration into the Warren area. Franklin/Oil City/Tionesta has been red hot this Fall and I think there is a large population on the way. The Amish have been struggling to put together large stringers (from what I can tell) and have not been fishing too much this Fall as compared to other years. The 2 Winters prior to 2015 were bad ass and the larger bass seemed to be arriving at their normal time. We had very good catches from 1994-2014 BUT I am chasing bass so infrequently that it is probably unfair to use my experiences as an accurate barometer. There have been (and always will be) those tough days sprinkled in between the fantastic days of 100+ fish between 3 guys.

So, I am not sure if there are too many fish being harvested or if it is just a water temperature thing keeping the final wave of bass from moving up. I am leaning towards over-harvesting. My Lowrance has not shown me the larger bait clouds over the past 2 Novembers either. Have the higher river levels had something to do with it this year? I am just not sure.

I do know one thing for sure......The musky numbers are lower than normal so maybe they are hung up with the bass somewhere South of Warren.

[ppalko]

We've discussed the bass situation in the Warren area (refinery dredge) last year and I'm pretty convinced that over-harvest has had quite an impact. The fishing took a huge nose dive for the past two years and actually was already in decline in terms of number 3 years ago. I fished that area in question for 20 years and it was incredibly predictable and the catch rate for bass was off the chart from October until the river hit 40 degrees. Flows had little influence other than to change locations within that area. One other interesting change in over the years was the walleye population. 3 years ago out of the blue, I caught as many walleyes as bass. Up to that time, I'd probably only caught 10 in 19 years from that area save for a really good year at the start of that bad streak for walleye. The bass population has really changed in my opinion and not for the better. Good luck with the musky...I think I may hit the Tionesta area of the weekend to see what kind of walleye numbers are available since I no longer head up to Warren with the lack of fish being the reason, I need a replacement.

[Red Childress]

Kinda slow for us this weekend. We hooked/rolled and lost 2 decent muskies with 1 other decent follow. The weather looked good, we looked good but evidently the fish did not think so. :)

[gfishes]

Kinda slow for us this weekend. We hooked/rolled and lost 2 decent muskies with 1 other decent follow. The weather looked good, we looked good but evidently the fish did not think so. :)


Bass catches have been down for us for two years now in the Emlenton/Kennerdell area. Sizes are still pretty good. However, the overall catch rates are down. Increased species diversity has increased however. This summer there was a day where our usual bass tactics resulted in more walleye than bass. This was a first in our 30 years of the area. Are bass populations controlled only by natural reproduction and slot limits?

[Red Childress]

To my knowledge, bass are not stocked anywhere in PA by the PFBC.

[Red Childress]

School cancelled Friday so I had time to dig myself out and take care of the boat launch for Saturday. We pounded the water all day in some rough weather/wind but only netted 1 smallish pike. No follows at all either. Decided not to fish on Sunday because the fishing has been very slow for my boat and keeping up with the snow plowing proved to be deal breaker. I was planning to fish 1 last weekend before Xmas but some very cold temps/bad weather coming for us here in Siberia....plus, a weak musky bite to boot. Decisions, decisions.

[Red Childress]

2016 is in the books I decided to put the boat away for awhile and take a break. It is just too much work keeping my hill/launch plowed well enough to get my boat back in the garage afterwards. (If we had a solid musky bite, I may be able to find the energy to keep going.:)) Good Luck to those of you who are still able to get out!

[25homes]

congrats on great season..cant say im not disappointed was hoping you was going over break..oh well will get with you in spring..think Im going over break couple times finish out season...merry christmas

[Red Childress]

Both my daughters are in basketball right now so it is time to hang with the family and enjoy the holidays. Good luck and be safe!

[Red Childress]

Big thaw on the way for Monday. Expect river levels to remain high and even increase over the next week or two.

[Red Childress]

Thinking about sneaking onto the river later this week if the temps hold up. River is high but may get super high following this thaw. Good luck and be careful out there!

[25homes]

Flow is pretty heavy right now and water is super high....Got out Sat and Monday with no Luck...Monday was up at lock 8 and was lots of ice on sides and big chunks floating down river...lots of debris and leaves...tried getting up in a cove of river dredged out for barges and was iced over and couldnt fish...Good luck if you get out hopefully better up your way than it was down mine...also about 99.9% for the 17th Red will know for sure first week of january hopefully that soon enough for you but about sure we good...Good Luck my Man

[Red Childress]

Just checked the extended outflow forecast and we will see a significant increase in outflow at the end of the week. Just too much thaw to avoid the increase. Looks like 2016 is definitely over for me with daughter's basketball tournament today and tomorrow and debilitating back spasms at the moment. Hopefully, January has mild temps with manageable snowfall.

[Red Childress]

River is officially blown out especially south of Warren. Water temps have really dropped quickly via snow melt. We got a solid 3 inches of wet snow last night with 4-10 more coming tonight/tomorrow. Lake effect snow warning until 10pm Friday night.

[Red Childress]

Has anyone been fishing anywhere?

Big snow dump on the horizon for this area......1-2 feet by Thursday nite.

[ttabaleulb]

The only fishing I'll be doing is on the internet unfortunately.

I don't do Resolutions, but I am setting a goal for myself for the next couple of years. I've never had a mount or reproduction of a fish in all my years of fishing. I am going to try like hell to get a decent Tiger (40+") with nice markings and get a repro done. I figure that I am due. Anyone who has had a repro done have any advice for measurements/pictures, etc..., please let me know.