Musky Trolling Rod Concept......Poll

[Frank Walsh]

What do you guys think of this concept? A trolling rod with a length and action designed specifically for trolling for musky with an integrated line counter built right into the rod. No, not a clip on, but a line counting mechanism that replaces the first line guide on the rod. I'm awaiting pictures and will add them when I receive them.

My thoughts:

From a conceptual concept, I love this idea. Most guys that troll even as little as a few days a year purchase a trolling rod rather than use a graphite casting rod that is too stiff, and brittle. Sometimes a catfish type rod that can be used for suckers, but a separate rod none the less.

A line counter reel is extremely valuable, but not mandatory. Therefore very few of us use quality line counters. Pretty much only the high frequency trollers. Most guys with line counters tend to buy the cheaper ones, that have very poor drag systems. Need constant adjustments, and can freeze up on a big fish. Integrating the line counter into the rod would allow you to use a high quality reel that you probably already own. I see this as a natural.

Another problem is the size of existing line counter reels. The existing models are really not big and beefy enough to handle Wishmaster and Harbourmaster sized lures. Te best solution has been to use the Penn 320 sized reels with a clip on line counter for the rod, but clip ons have their own issues.

Again, I see this as a winning concept, but am interested in your opinion.

So, as we say in Chicago.........Vote early, and vote often.

[JohnN]

Seems like a great idea to me, Frank. One other issue it would fix is the potential lack of consistency among line counters. Whether it's based on line diameter or a lack of accuracy in the reel, the reality is that just because your reel says 50' doesn't mean you have exactly 50' of line out. So if your idea works as advertised, I think it could mean better accuracy/consistency for trollers.

[Pikebob]

Depending on how far up the rod the first guide is, could make it cumbersome to view. Don't want to be hanging out too far over the boat in cold weather/water. Take that anyway you want!

[Illinois Dennis]

Frank,
As someone trying to solve an issue, you have narrowed this down to a specific, clean, nice, practical solution. Guess I would have to see one before I actually commit to one (not always a FIB; originally from the Show Me state). I'm in the process of building a trolling rod, no line counter. I used a 12 foot big boy salmon blank and modified it from the tip and butt to end up with something I was looking for; think it's a tad bit over 9 foot now. Handles done, just need to add the guides. It might be good for trolling; if not, casting.

My concerns with a built-in line counter:

1.) The distance away from you- easy to read?

2.) That line likes to freeze up you know, have ice pieces on it, etc. Don't know how the magic line counter will like handling that.

If it looked good and does the trick, I'd get one (or more for salmon trolling as well).

But for your life style Frank, I think you might want 2-3 of those dandy new 3-n-1 rods!

[Frank Walsh]

I was not looking for details. More so the concept. However great that you guys are asking questions and poising concerns. Will be read by people that make decisions.

Also, I kind of screwed up in my poll choices. I did not take into account the guys that like the concept, but are already well equipped for the few days they troll. Maybe make this notation in your comments.

[Tim Kelly]

Sounds like a great idea to me. Might want to make them 2 piece, so they can be stored easily, especially as they're probably not going to be used all day every day?

[fishwizard]

Never spent much time with a line counter, so I'll give my typical naive ideas. I imagine that putting much resistance after a high quality reel could give you some backlashing issues. Not an issue if you have the bait clicker engaged. You couldn't cast with them obviously, but wonder if there is anything to worry about happening such as a snag causing a backlash and then breaking you off before you can get the boat stopped? What are the biggest problems with the clip on line counters other than quality/performance? Sounds like a pretty good idea to me, as I'd probably rather buy one of these than a rod and reel trolling set-up.

[Drigansj]

Frank,

I think this is a great idea since you can use one of your casting reels and not have to buy a good linecounter reel to get a good drag system. My closest Muskie lake is Pomme de Terre Reservoir in central Missouri where I troll as often as I cast, so I already have a couple of trolling rods and two nice line counter reels. Excellent point regarding consistancy in line being let out regard less of the reel used or line size. I agree the rod should be two pieces. My trolling rods are 9 1/2' and I don't think I would go longer given a choice. If I wanted a wider spread, I would go to a board.

Finally, the position of the line counter on the rod should be fine as described, providing a great excuse for anyone should they fall out of the boat.

[Frank Walsh]

Thanks for the comments Drigansj, don't forget to vote.

[Frank Walsh]

Need to be registered.

[dpear]

Really,what is trolling?Websters suggests its to 'roll or revolve';or its to pass a vessel around while drinking(makes sense when I see who does it);To sing lustily or merrily(I've seen that as well)or to speak fast.
I'm confused and it makes me wonder,is it only Trolls that troll?:confused:

[hot karl]

i think the concept is a good one seeing how i fish left handed it would give a better option in choosing a reel (peen 321) but i wouldn't buy one right away seeing how i have 5 trolling rods now

[Frank Walsh]

Great point with the left hand reel not being available. Being selfish I never think of lefties.

[Brett]

Great concept,,

lots of hurtles to over come

I use line counters, and always know where my bait is in the water column.

Prefer counters to counting wraps as you can re set the depth after line getting ripped out bashing a shoal.

Curious to see what you have in mind.

The ice thing is a toughy,,, my line counters don't get affected

Would love to run the big pens though, like you say

[Doug Johnson]

Not too sure I'd like fooling with a line counter that's not on the reel. Little too hard to read when letting line out, and trying to run the boat at the same time. When the line counter breaks, you basically throw the rod away or buy a line counter reel, so you are back to getting a line counter reel. There are some very good line counter reels that don't cost and arm and a leg. I've used Okuma's for years and have never had one fail.

Doug Johnson

[Frank Walsh]

Great point Bret. Agree, ice is my biggest concern. Although you probably troll more days above freezing temperatures, than below, the device would have to be able to combat freezing temperatures. As well as being repairable.
Can't toss the rod for a broken counter.

Again, I'm suggesting the concept. The the final design.

[AndrewH]

I don't think it is a dumb idea but for myself I can't see a use for it. I like the linecounter right on the reel where it is easy to use and I know my linecounters are reliable. The only case I would see myself using this rod is, because I retrieve left, if I could use a bigger reel with left retrieve that could handle the big lures like a Swede 7001. Unfortunately no one on this planet makes a good linecounter in left hand retrieve. But then again, after using right hand linecounters for a couple seasons, now I am basically ambidextrous so its not all bad.:)

[Todd Forcier]

I’ve been thinking about this….I like the idea/concept of the built in counter. Would be able to just put a reel on and go. I see the concerns of what Bret & Doug talked about. However, I don’t use the counter much with the drop weights.

Frank, what length rod(s) are you thinking about?

[Frank Walsh]

The prototype I tried this fall was a 9 foot (2) piece. Overall a pretty nice rod, but I'm not sure of the exact changes made to the final product.

At that time, the line counter concept was not on the table for this rod. It has just come to the table this week.

Again, my biggest concern is the freezing weather, but right now it is still a concept, and I seed to see a "hands on" prototype to better judge the actual product.

[bozo]

Have been pretty pleased with STCroix Wild River, saddled with the Shimano Tekota LC. Never given me reason to be dissapointed. But then again, i've never towed anything around larger than a Jake.

I will be interested in seeing how the counter is placed on the rod though.

[Tim Kelly]

I don't think it is a dumb idea but for myself I can't see a use for it. I like the linecounter right on the reel where it is easy to use and I know my linecounters are reliable. The only case I would see myself using this rod is, because I retrieve left, if I could use a bigger reel with left retrieve that could handle the big lures like a Swede 7001. Unfortunately no one on this planet makes a good linecounter in left hand retrieve. But then again, after using right hand linecounters for a couple seasons, now I am basically ambidextrous so its not all bad.:)

Okuma make left handed line counters. I've got them! Magda 20 and 30 size I think.

[Frank Walsh]

Here is the line counter device.

[musky1969]

The idea seems ok but after getting 3 new rods and reels this season don't think I would be getting one for a while at least to wait for some feed back from people that had them. But if I was just starting out I would try one out because you can save some $ if you use one of your casting reels for that and all you need to buy is a new rod for trolling.
Darren

[Pikebob]

Just my opinion, looks like a major ice up/over issue.

Backlash

[GordP]

I think it's a good idea. I've had nothing but trouble with Okumas, go through a pair a season, season meaning 1-1.5 months of trolling. Magda 30's, Convectors... Can't trust them either. Constantly readjusting the drag, changes tension of it's own will, without touching it, it changes from too loose then to too tight, binds up, gears slip once in a while. Good point, at least they're cheap, which is good for a disposable one season use reel. Prefer to use my Penns, bullet proof reel, but using the clip on line counter sucks. Letting out line no problem, but if you momentarily hang up on bottom and let some line out, then it's reel in and start over. Sometimes drop a counter over the side, easy to do if it's cold and have with numb fingers. If someone could make a reliable, reasonably priced rod that let me use the Penn's I'd be all over it.

[DSmith]

One of the main problems I can see is the line icing and freezing up in the guide to the counter. It is also attached in an area that always gets abuse when putting the rod away. I for one, like the Tekota by Shimano and the St. Croix trolling rod and have no failures to date. The numbers are easy to read when letting line out and the rod shortens up by pushing it in the handle. I also use a downrigger and the built in rod counter would be hard to read when letting line out. I will stick with my current set-up.

[AlSmith]

Frank- I'd be willing to try it out next year for you. Let me know who to talk to if it's not Scott and I'll attach it and see what happens....

Al

[Brett]

I'm with Gord on the Okuma's, the drag is a bit touchy, so to over ride this, I use 100# line, gives a bit of room for error.

Was fishing the French a few weeks back, heck I had a tough time just getting the line out, the guides were all frozen. -16C is crap to fish in.

Early season, I'm seldom back more than 35', which is easily set visually as it's pretty much the end of the prop wash.

Late fall, when the fish are way down, counting back 120 or more is very critical.

That set up won't cut it for me.

Any how,,,, I'm going musky fishing tomorrow,,,,,, ha, ha,,,,,,, and Monday!

[GordP]

Ya, ya, but I'm going snowmobiling today!

[Frank Walsh]

Not me. Minus 9, with 25 mph north winds. I'll wait until tomorrow when it's 20 below, and I have to go to the post office.

Funny, but once the lake freezes, I develop a different mind set. Think a break from fishing is needed, but I'll start getting antsy in a few months.